The issues IMO with the mechanics and gameplay of the GBA FE Games

Design
1

EDIT: Changed issue #4.

EDIT: Changed the issue and reason for #5.

EDIT: 14. Bow range isn’t high enough.

Explanation:
Not only can magic counter bow attacks at 2 range, they can also hit the user up close at 1 range so there isn’t a counter attack, and throwing weapons can do the same thing, bows are the only weapons that can’t attack either without a counter attack, the range should at least be 2-3 IMO.

EDIT: 15. Mounted units should be unrescueable, should be able to rescue unmounted units, but shouldn’t be able to move again without the Savior skill.

Explanation:
Mounted units are very if not too good.

EDIT: 16. Boss weapons should be unbreakable.

Explanation:
I see little reason for the change to be done in the vanilla game if issue #1 on my list isn’t done, but if it is then it needs to be done.

EDIT: 17. One or all the stat boosting items need to be nerfed, especially the Angelic Robe, maybe (please don’t quote me on this) to +3 instead of +7, and to +1 instead of +2 for the rest, then make them more available through unique acquirement circumstances, like a hard to reach chest on a limited turn map, a hard to reach village, a unique purchase from a NPC merchant etc.

Explanation:
Stat boosting items can fix a weakness (or weaknesses) in a character that make them distinct and unique among the cast, while I think they should stay I also think they should be nerfed, especially the Angelic Robe, and then players can acquire more in the game as a reward for something impressive they do.

EDIT: 18. Most classes should only use one weapon.

Explanation:
If characters could use multiple weapons it could allow them to have the WPN Triangle advantage almost always which makes things much easier for the players especially if they are in good terrain.

  1. Weapon and stave uses are too high, making the uses redundant (hence Fates Infinite uses).

Explanation:
It allows you to stack weapons in your inventory and never use them,
(we’ve all been there,) and allows you to just use silver weapons or
Killer weapons with little worry, with reductions of the problem it
makes the sell prices go down a lot more per use, so if you acquired
a new weapon by exempli gratia an enemy drop, selling it could be a lot
more useful than just chucking it into the supply.

  1. Vulneraries and Elixirs have too many uses,
    they should have only 1 use IMO.

Explanation:
This gives too much forgiveness to the players and allows them not only
to heal three times but to heal, then have another unit trade it to their
inventory and heal them, and then rinse and repeat once more or more depending
on the number you have, compared to the enemies who can do it
only once if that, or if a boss has an Elixir/Vulnerary and is a tank
it just prolongs his/her inevitable end (imagine Lunatic Grima with a 3 use Elixir
shiver) when it could have just one use
and bam use it once they can’t use it again.

  1. Terrain gives too much avoid.

Explanation:
This is again so the player gets less favor from the
mechanics because the player will reach the better terrain first,
but this also helps the players if an enemy Swordmaster
got in a mountain or forest which is unlikely, if you’re a
good FE player but it’s still something.

  1. Most GBA playable characters base stats are too high, except characters who already have low stats like Nino, Amelia and Ewan.

Explanation:
This is so leveling up is a lot more varied,
even until the end of a players level ups and of course
because of the 30 stat cap, I don’t want enemies or players
to be capped in every stat by the end because that takes away
from the variability of the game, when members mentioned
‘stat inflation’ I set out to fix the problem, here it is.

The 30 stat cap GBA limit is also why
Nerf > Buff for the GBA. @MeatofJustice

  1. Weapon stats aren’t balanced.
    But specifically all weapons may need more
    hit rate maybe 5+ or 10+, and I guess the Killer weapons need to be nerfed,
    also I think the iron weapons MT needs to be reduced or bronze weapons need to be added.

Explanation:
Most enemies have low skill and luck, giving more hit to weapons
will balance out this difference and make the players hits more likely
to succeed and the enemies, not just the players, this way if the
player had an 80% chance of hitting they would have 85 or 90 instead,
and when it comes to already high
percentages higher is even better,
the Iron weapons MT being reduced or Bronze weapons being added makes the Def or Res stat better and armor knights as well.

also MT of weapons can be in the player’s favor as well, like
the Silver Sword, which does unusually high damage
(only one less of the Silver Lance???) and is
a weapon the player will mainly be using, specifically
the protagonist.

  1. Important enemy boss character stats aren’t high enough on Normal and higher difficulties, this does not apply to easy mode.

Explanation:
If there is an important boss like Lyon for example, without strong units I don’t think surviving his attacks should be guaranteed because that makes him dangerous and rewards players for good strategies. this does not apply to easy mode.

  1. Defense and resistance stats maximum at 30 isn’t high enough.

Explanation:
Weapon MT being too high causes this to be a problem.

  1. Weapon MT is too high and goes past 30 Atk too easily to 40-50, and so makes beating a general easy because of the 30 Def/Res cap.

Explanation:
I agree with Zmr nerfing weapon MT or class Str caps isn’t a good idea.

  1. Base classes should have varied class caps, so that a base class can’t go too high in every stat.

Explanation:
Stat boosters are what can make this a problem
if a player with a Mage got two Dracoshields and kept first/one turn resetting
for Defense they could have about 10 or 12 Defense, or if they got two
speedwings could have 16 or 20 Speed which I feel is too much.

  1. Weapons, staves, and items don’t cost enough.

Explanation:
Most of the time at the end of the game you have
too many weapons in the inventory and haven’t used many,
this will reduce how many weapons you can keep and makes
enemy weapon, stave, item drops, and chests, much more appreciated.

  1. Class base stats, need to be balanced better.

Explanation:
Most Magic classes have odd very low Atk or Magic stats,
the Soldier class is pathetic, the Assassin class has the OP
lethality and odd bases (that are just as good as a Theif’s? W-what???)
The mercenary classes base stats are too high etc.

  1. (For FE7-8 only.)
    WPN TRI. improves/reduces Hit and Avoid too much
    at 15+ or - Hit and Avoid, I recommend 10+ or - Hit and Avoid.

Explanation:
Enemy and player balance again.

  1. The text speed options aren’t useful, and the
    normal text speed is slow.

Explanation:
The Slow and Normal option is what I’m
talking about here I should have mentioned that, who
uses those two options? I think everyone can read just fine without the slow text speed,
and the FE6, FE8, and JP FE7 text speed I still find slow on normal.

----------------------------------------------------

Here are some of my opinions on the issues with the GBA games, they are of course also some small problems I have with: The Sacred War and Project Ember hacks. In case anybody is working on a hack and wanted to improve the gameplay of their games, some issues to consider could be here.

Concerning why I consider these problems:

Let me start by saying for me I feel most FE games
unfairly favor the the player, with broken weapons
(like the killer, silver, reaver, and throwing weapons)
and characters especially because of there high base stats
and high growths, I feel the ‘strategy’ element of FE
is made too easy to disappear because of the problems I’ve pointed out,

and so you know, I’m talking about the GBA FE games on
their Normal difficulty level, Hard or higher can be just as easy IMO, but takes
more grinding, if you don’t farm EXP you could have a very annoying time
finishing the game, and might even get stuck mid playthrough,

a very good example of that is the final chapter of PoR on Hard mode
but it’s BEXP LV up resetting instead of EXP farming,
(assuming you didn’t know about the Wrath and Resolve combo
and didn’t get Nasir)

if you weren’t carefully increasing
Ike’s stats and getting certain scrolls you can get stuck at the end.

If you played on Normal, of course, the beginning has medium difficulty, but as you play through the strategy element disappears or reduces, the player becomes laidback and IMO
just slogs through the game with boring bosses and enemies,

to make characters even better you have broken stat boosters that
can fix pretty much any stat, especially the Angelic Robe
which gives a large HP increase of 7,

think about Seth, Ike or Ryoma only FE playthroughs.
The reason why I want most of these changes is so that the game
favors the player less and favors the CPU more, and as a result
makes the gameplay more balanced between the player
and the CPU, so that on any difficulty having a single
character playthrough is more difficult, and on
the hardest difficulty without farming impossible.

2

And what do you all think about the mechanics and gameplay of FE? What do you all think could be improved?

3

So this is interesting. I’m going to put out my thoughts on each of these one by one.

  1. A staple of the fire emblem games (Besides 2/15 and 14)

  2. Honestly if either of those had to have one use it would be elixirs, Vulneraries are fine as is.

  3. That’s kinda the point of terrain in these kinda games, Advance Wars had this as well as wargroove.

  4. You get like a max of 12ish on a map, the enemy tends to have double that or more.

  5. I don’t really get this.

  6. They seem fair enough, plus they wanted to make the game beatable even if you messed up bad.

  7. Defense and Resistance aren’t meant to be reliable unless you have a lot of it. Most units don’t have good defense and resistance.

  8. The weapons are fine as is.

  9. Fire emblem 13/14

  10. Honestly the pricing seems fine

  11. Honestly this is one of the few complains I kinda get. But once again the enemies come in big groups.

  12. That’s the reason to use other weapons.

  13. There is a way to get all the text to appear all at once, pretty standard.

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You haven’t really said why these issues are issues. You’ve just kind of said, this is an issue, and left it at that. It’d help too if you gave specific case examples of these issues in action and how the games could be improved by fixing those issues, as well as which units/classes/maps/items these issues applied to the most and where it perhaps doesn’t hold as true. As it stands there isn’t much I can comment on what you’ve said other than saying that’s just your opinion man.

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Wow, I disagree with a lot of this!

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I agree with Zaim that we need more context and details. Different design decisions can work, depending on what experience you’re going for and how you holistically balance everything.

Relatedly, it’s also odd to lump all of FE6-7-8 together, as they have different issues. For example, 7 and 8 often have very low enemy quality, while I’d argue 6 enemies can be too bulky.

Could you describe for us your ideally balanced FE experience, and how these changes would help achieve that? I think it would go a long way to help spur intelligent discourse about this list.

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I disagree with almost all of this lol

Fates’ system not only is convoluted, it’s actually worse than having durability with all of the weird secondary effects going on. Debuffing yourself, no follow-up attacks, no critical hits, enemy gets increased critical hits, etc. You might be able to argue staff uses are too high, but weapon uses in gba are fairly low compared to the others in the series (compare the steel sword durability throughout the series as a quick example).

… ? Why? Elixir you may be able to argue, but why a vulnerary? You want less staff uses AND less healing items lol

Thrones/Peaks sure, everything else disagree. The games teach you to use terrain to your advantage; +5 avoid isn’t going to make a difference, so why even bother having the forest tile there to begin with?

I guess? This is sort of a series problem and not a gba-exclusive problem because… Well every map you’re outnumbered. If your stats were on par with a generic or worse, it would make every map a slog and a half.

You need to give some more information here. You want less terrain avoid and more weapon hit, what you’re asking for is effectively cancelling out a mechanic.

You want to sit in front of a boss for 8 turns and have them able to take ~5 damage from your units and deal 35+ to all of them just because they’re plot important? Why?

Again, why?

You’re doing that whole cancel out a mechanic thing again.

There’s something here, but it’s almost unnecessary. I get not wanting an armor knight to get to 20 speed, but the only one that even could is probably like… Amelia. Feels like more trouble than it’s worth.

Either you played too much fe5 or you’ve been grinding in the arena for too long. Going to ask for another explanation here.

Sure, mercs and myrms having basically the same bases is kind of stupid. Agree on this one for the most part.

Again, the purpose of the weapon triangle is to reward the player for making good decisions. By making this reward even smaller, they are less inclined to see it as a reward and therefor won’t care about it. Personally I think the weapon triangle needs to be more impactful, not less.

Just lol @this one

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1 - How is this true for anything other than iron weapons? Especially when the games have a pretty good habit of giving you rare weapons long before you can buy them. Their uses absolutely matter when buy more is not an option. For example FE6 only gives you 40 killing edge uses between chapter 4 (where you get your first edge) and the end of chapter 13 (where you can finally buy as many as your pockets permit), and the early chapters flood you with scenarios where you want to use the killing edge because for most of that time window it’s your best sword by far, but 40 uses deplete pretty quickly if you go ham. Uses matter on the more expensive buyable weapons like silvers and reavers even when they become buyable.

2 - How is making staff users less dominant a problem?

5 - Well you didn’t mark this as FE6 only so I have to question why FE7/8 weapons need more hit when the least accurate weapons (that aren’t Eclipse) are already very capable of reaching 100% hit WITHOUT weapon triangle advantage because enemy avoid is in the toilet in those games. Killer weapons basically being better steels is daft though yeah.

6 - The overwhelming majority of GBA bosses are immobile throne/gate hogs, and making those take twice as many turns to bring down does not make them more compelling because it’s still trivial to keep everyone alive while fighting them due to their lack of movement.

7 - How is this not high enough? Hardly any generic enemies in the GBA games exceed 30 attack even on hard mode, those that do don’t exceed it by much except in FE6 where the difficulty isn’t a joke, outside of that it’s really only certain bosses that shut down tanking, and even then, having defense/resistance is still good. Just because you’re not taking literally 0 damage doesn’t mean it’s providing absolutely no benefit. Super-low def units are very prone to being oneshot, especially in FE6. If anything, the def/res caps for units that aren’t supposed to be dedicated tanks are too HIGH. If I can achieve 25 def on a paladin, why should I bother using a general who has 30 def but takes twice as long to get into the action?

8 -Okay, so let’s say we implement everything thus far. Lowered player stats, raised boss stats, raised def/res across the board, AND lowered the might of weapons across the board. So now it takes multiple turns of multiple of your units pounding on one generic unit to kill it, multiple turns of multiple of THEM pounding on one of YOUR average units to kill it, your dedicated tanks are literally unkillable except by the boss (and even then you might be able to wall them too), and you can’t hurt bosses at all without S rank weapons or something. …What issue is this supposed to fix again?

10 - Not magic? No? If there’s anything that doesn’t cost enough, it’s magic. Fire tomes are cheaper per use than hand axes for crying out loud.

12 - Okay, so let’s say we implement everything thus far. Weapons get more hit when it’s already feasible to get consistent 100 hit rate without WTA, terrain avoid is nerfed so that 100 hit rate is going to be even more consistent, and then weapon triangle hit adjustments get nerfed. So now weapon triangle basically boils down to the +/- 1 might which by itself is almost pointless unless you boost the damage aspect of weapon triangle… which you aren’t suggesting, so why even have weapon triangle at that point? I guess if we also factor in the part from before where damage gets deflated and bulk gets inflated, then +/- 1 might suddenly matters a lot when people are struggling to do more than 3 damage, but WHY WOULD ANYONE DO THIS.

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I want you see you make a FE rom hack with all of these changes and post it here and let see how bad/good it is

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I don’t think attacking the OP is necessary. They gave their opinion, we give ours; we’re not here to belittle.

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These kind of discussions never work because issues get singled out and/or approached in tandem and it all ends up intertwined like a spider’s web. Try and make sense of any of it and you’re just gonna end up with a headache.

There’s also context for a lot of things that’s easy to get too attached to or lose sight of, things like it being handheld and thus needing things to be prompt and less tedious for easier pick ups and put downs. Things like the game being easier to cater to more casual crowds, character power due to the nature of army sizes.

My opinions I know don’t line up with a lot of peoples when it comes to FE, that stems mostly from me being more fond of other genres and games and wanting to merge design mentalities. I think a lot of purist perspective lies on these boards for sure.
If not purist, then at least bias towards their favourites and a strict sense of needing to adhere to all the same approaches and designs of that title.

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(Everything else I wanted to say got, more or less, said. I’ll skip over those things.)

GBA playable characters base stats are too high.

Are they really? – But regardless; if they are too high and we lower them;

Important enemy boss character stats aren’t high enough.

Then this automatically becomes less of a problem. These are the same statement. “Enemy stat quality is too low”. Whether it applies to generic enemies or bosses or both; these bullets are identical.

Weapon stats aren’t balanced.
But specifically all weapons need more hit rate maybe 5+ or 10+, and I guess the Killer weapons need to be balanced.

Increasing the hit rates of the weapons would imbalance them more; by making axes have no drawbacks. We can observe this in the Tellius and DS games, where most of the axe users have reasonable Skill scores / Avoid isn’t as prominent / et cetera; and they have a radical insane time.

Base classes should have varied class caps, so that a base class can’t get stats too high in every stats.

In my opinion, the primary point is to let promoted units feel special and cool. Showing how they’re amazing by having them have both specializations and general excess over the normal units – is something that has much less meaning when you get varying caps because the bars don’t move around more relatively (which is why it is such a crime that DSFE removed them!).

But, you could flat reduce the cap; which would keep it, I suppose? Which could be interesting too.

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OP, which FE is your “gold standard” ???

So look at the clear time in your save. Is it what, 20 or 30 hours?
Maybe you played more and reached ~60hours.
Now imagine half of that is spent in the menu and armory constantly swapping equipment every map.
Double that if you want to use a Silver Card on every unit.
Terribly boring experience.

Just so you know, I went there (with my old hack which I try to delete from existence)
and not just everyone but me also hated spending all this time playing the inventory game.

Equipment Slot value > Item Use Value
No one would trade 1 valuable Equipment Slot for 1 Vulnerary or even Elixir.
This would only make all consumables lose worth and never even being considered to be brought on the field.

Terrain manipulation > Stat/ Skill comparison like some TCG.
But that’s just me.

Compared to what? On what difficulty?
To the 30 cap OR the enemy’s base?

For reference, with good growth rates + Growth rate Booster (+10%)
it took on average 50~60 LvUps to max out everything without stat boosters.
In comparison a Unit with low base and low growth (like a mage’s DEF or Knoll’s lol LCK)
needed ~90LvUps.

Depends on what you want.
Weapon HIT/CRT rates are mostly based on enemy performance without including Support bonuses.
Supports are a bonus for those who go after them.
OR we could make Supports mandatory like in those Kaizo games. Are you a Kaizo runner?

No comment. Really depends on what you want to achieve.
But if you are asking for RNG luck based fights in the first 10 or so Chapters, sorry I disagree vehemently.

If a unit (enemy-player) takes 3~4 hits to die,
that means it takes 2~3 units to kill it or 2~3 Action economies.

If a unit (enemy-player) takes 5~7 hits to die,
that means it takes 3~5 units to kill it or 3~5 Action economies.

Now consider enemy and player density and map travel time,
you can easily go from a decently paced gameplay to a slog.
Unless you have a 5v5 arena deathmatch in mind.

On paper it sounds fine.
In practice you are given a choice:
Do I grind 5~7 more levels so that the low growth rate stats increase some more
while losing stat gains on capped high-growth stats
or do I promote now and increase the stat caps
while carrying those low-growth low-stats into the promotion?

Are you one of those that reach the final map with Iron tier weapons?

No comment. But you should know you can never reach 100% balance perfection.
It’s impossible.

(and I was planning to increase to WT effects on the next project to ±20HIT/AVD and ±2DMG lol)

Then put it on fast or press “A”?
Am I missing something? Did you mean something else?

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My take on it:
1:If uses were redundant, why did the fates devs chose to rebalance the weapons to make infinite uses fair?(even tho they failed). kinda makes me think the system with uses is less powerful in theory. alsom staves have uses still in that game, so lul.

2:vulneraries are not exactly overpowered. They are supposed to keep people alive. Elixirs make more sence, but some maps are designed around being able to fullheal 3 times per item.

3:This sounds more like an echoes or fe6 complaint and not like something that is an issue in fe7 or 8.

4:yes but actually no. Some folks are too powerful like pent, but other people are too weak. Like, you really cannot convince sophia is too strong and needs to be nerfed.

5:the weapons are accurate enough to be a threat once the game is designed around being difficult. I tried the first two chapters of fe6 with fixed weaponstats and that stuff is scary if you do not solo it with marcus. That is a difficultylevel I want to see more of, not the completely rediculous stuff like first two chapters of hector hardmode where one is basicly at the mercy of enemyplacement.

6:yes, but we also should not overshoot

7:talking about maxed units is a pitfall

8:I agree in theory, but it would be easier to just rebalance the stats in general instead of aiming for caps.

9:yeah, it is kinda disappointing that all classes have the same caps in the basecategory. but it is not like a mage will get 20 def anyways.

10:problem with all fe games except maybe por jp

11:yeah, some classbases are too op while others are just…why?

12:the 5 hit do not make or break the world. While I agree that it is unnessesary, it just makes it more worth it to pay attention to gamemechanics.

13:They are not useful…in what way? Are instant and hast too fast or do you mean that the slower options are too slow? Also, they made everything slightly slower in fe7US, so maybe you mean that specificly. This is really the point you should elaborate on the most because it is just “it sucks” without any parameter to change.

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NGL when I read this I thought it was a joke thread:

  1. You start with basic weapons at the start of the game, where you’ll have less money, so having so many uses really helps. And Fates did the whole nerfing thing on those infinite weapons, which was pretty dumb, buffs are better than nerfs.
  2. They aren’t overpowered or anything. You won’t have meany healers on earlygame so those uses help (imaging having to spend more than 2 slots on healing drinks) and Elixirs are expensive.
  3. It has more to do with how GBA calculates Avoidance.
  4. It’s better to buff enemy bases, bigger numbers are more attractive. And again, buffs > nerfs.
  5. In Binding Blade, sure, they need those accuracy buffs, and Dark Magic needs help in general. But that issue lies more in the quality difference between playable and enemy units.
  6. As someone else said, you can’t make both player stats lower and boss stats higher or they become too tedious; or so hard you’re forced to exclusively use your early prepromote if you don’t want to sacrifice units. Other than the final boss, you have to be creative on how to make a grand, entertaining boss battle.
  7. That has to do more with GBA limitations, and stat caps usually don’t matter.
  8. You might make the game too slow with everything needing so many hits to be taken down.
  9. I agree they should have different caps, but for another reason. I feel that having 20 as a cap for all of them it makes base classes less special. I don’t like your reason because it could kill the niches some characters have.
  10. I think some lategame weapons are too expensive, but you could just give the player less money. For earlygame weapons, you have much less money, and if they give you many units you might want weapons for all of them, forcing you to trade too much could make the pacing too slow.
  11. Care to give examples? Mages have low bases to balance how good magic is on theory, and in FE6 you have the story/gameplay integration of Wyvern Riders and their prowess.
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3H designer spotted.

More seriously, I agree that it’s better to buff enemy bases, but that’s because FE8 enemies have like no stats.

This so much. I do agree that bosses could use a bit more HP so they need a bit of concentrated fire to take down, but don’t bloat the other stats. The thing about bosses is that ‘blob of stats on a throne’ isn’t fun in Fire Emblem and it never will be. It’s just a stat/RNG check, there’s no real decision making involved. Make bosses move, give them reinforcements, do something with them that means it isn’t just your stats vs their stats.

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Dude, you perfectly described what is wrong with FE6 with that blob of stats on throne-statement. I talked about how the very beginning of FE6 is pretty good actually, but damas is just a crapshoot without Marcus because of how nonsensical his tankyness makes him.

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I think you’re misunderstanding the purpose of defensive stats. Capped defense does not and should not equate to taking zero damage in all cases. If this were universally the case, strategy would devolve into min-maxing def/res as high as possible as early as possible and then have zero worries about anything for the rest of the game; this just becomes boring very quickly as all decision making is rendered irrelevant with an effective win button at all times. High defense should not make a unit immune from all damage, ever. Lowering weapon might so that high defense within vanilla caps makes you invincible is the opposite of a solution. Remember that these changes apply to enemies as well as you; having a unit that takes no damage is one thing, facing an enemy that takes no damage is another.

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I don’t think it should mean zero damage if a unit is capped in or has high defense but it should mean a lot less damage then the damage powerful units like Fighters deal to for example knights in most FE Games,

the reason is because the main thing about a knight is defense and if high defense is made less important as the game goes on for say speed, then Knights and Generals become less useful to the point Paladins and Warriors could defeat them easily because they have powerful weapons and faster speed, they can do 10 to 20 damage without an armorslayer and double, and since the uses for weapons in FE are so high they can just keep attacking until the General falls or just use an armorslayer, plus that Generals have lower movement and a weakness to magic, to make things worse Paladins can use axes in FE7 and the main weapon of a General is a lance

their armor is just not as useful as the Paladins 15+ avoid weapon triangle sword bonus against a Warrior with an axe and Paladins can normally defeat a Sage because of the higher movement, resistence, and physical damage, the General then is less useful then it should be.

IMO if the Knight or General class is going be more useful, Armorslayers and Magic should be your main options to defeat them and not bashing them with a powerful weapon because with the reduction or removal of the problems I’ve talked about, that would wear down the uses very quickly of any weapon, with my edits Silver weapons have 10 uses and every use loses 360G from it’s sell value which loses a lot of money and makes the weapon break quickly, players would then be a lot more likely to save the powerful weapons for when they need them, and to choose to get Armorslaying weapons which gives them a lot more value.

I’ve found effective weapons to just not be as useful as they’re supposed to be, from low MT, to too much weight.

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That’s more of a problem with the Armor Knight line itself and the enemies who have those classes. GBA Fighters aren’t very good unless they’re prepromotes, they’re slow but the enemy armored units are slower. And while ideally armor breaking weapons and magic should be the best way to get rid of them there should be room for strong units to deal damage without them to avoid softlocking the player (who might want to do a challenge run of some kind and won’t use/lost use of certain characters and/or items).

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