Telos Talks About:

Tbh, I honestly agree, imho.

(Sorry, couldn’t resist! Honestly. :smile:)

Honestly, some people smh :pensive:

Indeed, indeed…

Here we go!

Today on ‘Telos Talks About’, we’re talking about Siege Tomes!

You can find the link by clicking here.

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This isn’t true. Status staves use 1RN; siege tomes use the standard 2RN.

Ah my bad lol. I got the two confused. I’ll fix it now.

How about Light Magic? I’m interested in hearing your take on it

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It sounds like Kitozawa is working as intended.

Alright, I’mma add that to the list…

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Waiting out siege tomes is a cheesy strategy. I don’t see an issue with giving enemies high use siege (or even unbreakable siege) to prevent this.

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It is a cheesy strategy- but sometimes, that’s really the best option you’ve got imo- especially if you don’t have the means to get to where the seige tome user is quickly.

Ultimately, though, it depends on the player- some prefer to chance it and rush in; others prefer to wait it out.

Though I really don’t think high usage/unbreakable seige is a good idea because of this- it turns the process of crossing territory with a siege tome from a, at worst, temporarily hazardous trip to a perpetually risky voyage that’s very likely going to wear down on a player’s nerves quickly- especially if there’s already a lot going on in the map to begin with.


Duly noted. Thankfully, for me, Kitozawa is dead now.

The problem i have with siege tomes is there never seems to be any middle ground between “entirely ineffectual” and “hilariously big no-go instant death zone”. Either it’s eclipse, and lol, or it’s Shadowshot with 40 attack and half my army evaporates instantly if they go near a huge chunk of the map.

I think they can be fun when they’re on my characters the game provides good ways to disable them. It feels good warping a unit with a killing edge next to that purge asshole bishop. It does not feel good being pelted with bullshit that you have no way of countering.

The issue is it’s incredibly obnoxious and depending on map design can render the level unwinnable if the characters aren’t panning out…

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It really do be like that sometime. Like… siege tomes are one of those things that can honestly make or break a level.

IMO, you can honestly use it to create a variety of atmospheres- actually, Chapter 21 of Awakening is, IMO, a good use of how you can use them to create an atmosphere of fear, for example.

In the context of the scenario, this is a trap- the siege tomes are there to make sure that you eventually will die to what’s coming for you, slowly and inexorably- while giving the player good reason to move forward. (Especially on harder difficulties where the Mire is stronger.).


in my opinion, if the player’s forced to wait out the siege until it runs out, that’s horrible game design. As Vilk said, having an option to deal with the siege unit is fun, having to wait out or attempt to deal with a Shadowshot that evaporates anything it touches is not.

One thing I like to think about a lot is Advance Wars indirects. They’re placed like siege units, just closer to the front lines. However, the mechanics of that game basically force you to deal with it ASAP, as units effectively have infinite ammo if they’re on a city or an APC resupplies them. Depending on how a player places an indirect, you can seriously destroy an opponent and lock down their options. It only gets more compounded when you consider indirects like the Battleship, which as long as you keep it safe from submarines, indirects, and bombers, the Battleship is basically invincible.

I feel like something like Advance Wars indirects should be how the player carrying a siege tome feels like. Without the infinite ammo, of course

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Mmmhm! I totally agree with you there.


Ballista and siege tomes that can only be used if the user doesn’t move. Now I wonder which hack will implement this first.

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Depends on who makes the ASM for it…

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Regarding the opinion on sword master bosses, I find myself inclined to agree. While I do not think the speed is an issue (on HM most units cannot double anyways, and any decent merc and myrm might double) it’s the fact that a constant crit chance can ruin the most well thought out of strategies. Armour knight that can surive four hits? 17% crit and it’s gone. I extend this opinion to other bosses with higher crit chance like berserkers or other classes with an innate crit increase, it’s quite painful to deal with, and having a ‘hoplon guard’ is usually a waste of inventory space otherwise.

VQ’s sword master boss, despite the initial surprise, was really easy to cheese with a unit with decent res on fort tile, as he wastes turns using a flame sword from a distance which can’t crit at range, giving the opportunity to set up a kill. However giving him a chance to use another weapon is pretty much a GG for any unit, which is less fun.

Completely unrelated to the topic, but said armour knight with leadership stars is actually quite good due to his massive promotion gains and access to all magic and staves.

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React for Sword master bosses review:
(Wait whos mr.K is that in a hack I never played)

  1. 30/15 crit and wodao/killung edge (fe78 and most hacks) is truly disturbing in earlier game, can one shot nearly every units if the sm has higher str (silver sword too)
    2 super high hit/ avoid making him hard af to hit and nearly sure death without crit for squishies
    Example:Gel with that light brand for 1 2 range atk and Carlyle with the wind sword and Lloyd in ch27
    Methods to counter: just stay at 2 range so he cant do anything and use archers/mages to wear him down eventually
    Or just Use a super high def wyvern lord/general to take him face on
    Fe7 and most hacks
    Ok what if I make a moving swordmaster boss and give them a shxx wo dao? Then thats about 50+ crit and no luck can offset it
    Lloyd plz dont kill my healer again
    Thats probaly why telos talking
    They can pick their targets with ease and kill ur squishy / lord unit resulting in a restart
    Counter:use high def unit/iron rune/hoplon guard to lure them in the range of a lot of other ranged attackers and make a salad out of him
    Some gay hack makers:how bout magic swords have crit (or even worse gives more crits and even have 1 to 3 range or put down a magic seal for forbiding magic supportive fires yes I’m talking about you dlatmol (Dark soul and the masochist players)
    Counter:I cant think of one that doesnt consist of very good growths and luck (maybe sword slayer would do?)
    Tho if u do, ur peg rider probably can not get doubled and might dodge the hit/crit anf hit him well(high spd/luck and lance advantage)
    Toxic area:yes the hell amount of 100 hit on you and less than 50 hit on him is literally bs and some hacks wont give you enough iron runes for the safety sometimes theres many units around the sm so ur general will be very dangered if put into the sm boss range so to hell with this shxx I’m fking done with it lets use some save states or luck it out with a playable swordmasters crit maybe we should only let those who ever deal with the assassin boss in vestaria to make swordmaster bosses
    Luckily some hacks is kind enough not to make the sm have high str so ur unit can survive after getting crit’d or making sm boss having less spd and skill
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This is a good ramble. I like it a lot and it’s very much an issue that feels like it isn’t given its due consideration.

But I feel like it could be generalized more, enemies with bonus crit chance in general are disastrous to fight against.

Oh, oh oh! You should try having 1 range shortbows. And archers that don’t suck. And not have a plethora of 2-3 weapons.

There are certain advantages to having one-range bows that we can definitely talk about. For example; they enable player archers to position in more useful tiles. They allow enemy boss archers to, uh, be things better.

There are numerous perks to being able to position your archers. You know, like how you can position most of your other units. It allows them to more actively participate in the player phase.

If giving archers the ability to counter at melee is something you dislike, which I also agree with, it doesn’t seem like that much of a burden to make it unable to counter for the high utility that it affords the player to let them just use their units.

Another thing that makes Indirects far easier to deal with is how movement ranges are tuned in Advance Wars –
• Light Tanks have 6 movement and you always build them they are the best
• Artillery have 2-3 range and are the biggest pound-for-pound indirect (the Rockets is 3-5 but costs more than twice as much)
• Indirects cannot move-and-shoot on the same turn.

The boss is a Berserker. With a Tomahawk. The boss of Hector’s is a Hero, also with a Tomahawk.
The legendary weapons in fe7 are prf locks. :v


In my opinion, siege tomes are dumb because they have low hit rates and high might – ie; they’re very unlikely to matter if you just camp out in Forests, and you have high incentive to do that because they hit very hard; and most FE chapters are not really designed around demanding you to rush forward – and the ones where the developers do want you to sprint forward they don’t tend to put any siege weapons on the map.

Players hate their units dying, after all. It doesn’t seem like much of a shock.

So to me, having high uses on siege weapons either makes me sit and waste more turns/times; or start making stupid plays because i’m not going to sit there for 20 turns while i wait for it to run out of ammo that’s incredibly boring.

And as mentioned, you never fight 'just` siege tomes, either; and it makes calculating survivability of units harder than it ought to be and and and.

And, of course, since this is not Advance Wars, the AI will happily move their siege unit out of the way before having it pelt you more, and because in this game series units on foot tend to have flat movement you effectively are required to charge with a dancer or horses in order to ever be able to catch the attacker in range; or manipulate their AI to move towards your units.

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