How would you make a final boss?

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Personally, when it comes to Fire Emblem, I tend to be inclined to think of the entire final map the player plays as the “final boss”, the reason for this being that Fire Emblem’s mechanics are not designed in such a way as to facilitate actually making more “standard JRPG-scale” fights interesting to play.

Because the game mechanics kind of inherently kneecap the potential of a singular-enemy final boss fight to be interesting—to the point that IntSys themselves resorted to grafting additional mechanics onto enemies in attempts to make them interesting to fight by themselves—so I think a final battle should instead play to the engine’s strengths. Not to say that the map should be massive or overloaded with enemies, but an “army versus army” scale is what Fire Emblem’s mechanics are best at, as well as the scale on which the rest of the game will likely have trained the player to think and operate. Designing the final battle to be fought on the same scale would also, I feel, be the best way to make it a good capstone of the gameplay side of the experience.

There’s nothing wrong with single-opponent final boss fights in Fire Emblem, but I definitely think they work much better as “denouement battles” than actual challenging gameplay sections within the context of Fire Emblem’s mechanics.

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For a final boss/map, my ideas are mostly drawn from other final/endgame maps in the series.

I decided that it would be best to have a “Gotoh”-like character, or maybe the lord, fight the final boss by themselves. They would be separated from the rest of the army similar to that one endgame tower map in FE10, though the main army would be able to impact the fight. There would be mini bosses throughout the map, like in FE5 or FE7, that would need to be dealt with by the player’s army in order to weaken the final boss OR strengthen the separated character to a point where they can actually win.

I think this would fit well with Fire Emblem’s stories typically being about a legendary hero defeating some kind of ancient evil with a legendary weapon. The hero’s allies would act as the last bit of support necessary to win, highlighting how the bonds between allies are what give people strength.

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I really wanted to create a final boss with a lot of HP. I feel like even 120 hp isn’t enough. Since you can’t exceed the cap of 127… Putting multiple uneven Hp bars will be just fine. With a little surprise when the boss is down to his last HP bar.

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Well, I mean Sombron has 7 health bars divided between his two forms with a combined total of 680HP on normal if I remember right.

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In my opinion, multiple health bars is good final boss design. It prevents a single, massively overpowered unit from wrecking the final boss by itself. By ensuring that even the most busted unit can only kill one bar at a time, the boss remains on the field to pose a threat.

The other reason is system limitations. GBAFE has a hard HP cap of 127, so if you want the boss to last a good long while, the only way is to give it multiple healthbars. This isn’t too hard to do; just spawn another unit in upon the final boss’ death.

In terms of boss stats, I personally prefer an approach similar to FE12 Lunatic Medeus, though with some changes. On that difficulty, Medeus’ stats present every bit the threat he is made out to be over the course of the story. With 30 SPD, he doubles all but the fastest classes, and with 60 ATK, he 2HKO’s anything in the game, even Generals. 40 DEF makes even maxed units with Regalia deal single-digit damage, and the Falchion just 24 at max. The fight makes you feel very outclassed; the strongest mortals with the best weapons can barely scratch him, and that is what a final boss should be like when made out to be a threat much greater than what humans are capable of.

That being said, Medeus does take these stats too far in a regard. First, this is Lunatic difficulty, hence he’s supposed to be absurdly difficult. On Maniac, he’s almost as strong, though a bit more lenient on the SPD front, while Hard and Normal are pretty easy by comparison. Forcing the player into a narrow selection of 5-6 classes is not good game design.

As such, in regards to stat distribution, the final boss should feel imposing, without outright being near-impossible. It should have enough speed that most medium-speed classes (Hero, Paladin, Sage etc.) can’t double it even if capped, though do risk being doubled if they are lacking severely in speed. Slow classes (General, Wyvern Lord etc.) should always get doubled, but should be among the only classes capable of surviving two hits if bulky enough, as bulk is what slower units excel at anyways. Fast classes (Swordmaster, Falcoknight etc.) should be able to double the final boss by the skin of their teeth, as their lower STR caps limit their per-hit damage. As for durability, ideally “weak” classes should do about as much damage with two hits as “strong” classes do with one. As the difference in STR cap is 8 points at the greatest, you usually only want the final boss to take 6-10 damage from weaker classes per hit, hitting twice, while stronger classes can nuke the final boss for 16-24 damage at a time. Any well-trained unit with an S-rank weapon should be able to achieve this; everyone should have their fair shot of fighting the final boss if trained.

As these stats are mostly based off of class caps, some degree of insurance is needed in case the player walks up with a mostly-dead army and an undertrained Lord. It is the Gotoh’s job to prevent this. Whatever class the Gotoh is in, they should have stats at or near caps, or else have exceedingly high growths to ensure they reach these thresholds by killing enemies on the final map for EXP, which they should be able to without too much effort. They should start with an S-rank in something, enough stats to use that S-rank weapon competently against the final boss, or else have their own PRF to the same effect. This ensures that you will always have someone that can kill the final boss, though the Gotoh will still need healing support to do the job, and can’t do it as fast as a crew of 4-5 maxed units can. On that note, put some droppable Elixirs in the final map so the Gotoh won’t run out of healing before they can slowly chip the final boss to death.

As for the Lord and their Legendary Weapon designed to wreck the final boss, the Lord should be subjected to much of the same stat bracketing as other classes; they do not outclass the final boss on their own. The Legendary Weapon should enable the Lord to do more damage than anyone else can, but that’s it. It shouldn’t enable the Lord to take a 2nd hit (reserved for bulky classes) or double the final boss (reserved for fast classes), and, due to the presence of a Gotoh that can kill the final boss by themselves, if slowly, using the Lord and their Legendary Weapon to kill the final boss faster is a privilege, not a right. If your Lord is undertrained, then you must spend the extra time with the Gotoh doing the job. It should not instantly make the Lord competent at fighting the final boss; powerful weapons are as powerful as their wielder, and a wielder that dies in one round shouldn’t be very powerful due to it.

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Eh, multiple healthbars is really more of a bandaid the a solution to be honest. There are also some flaws to how some of your ideas can end up working.

I’ve played somewhere around 50 hacks at this point and only encountered this idea three times.
Terror of the Forest, Dark Lord and the Maiden of Light, and one more i honestly can’t remember the name of currently, the issue really stems from the desire to actually have the bosses forms actually have some story with them rather then for it to just be for its own sake.

This is the worst idea, even knowing you still wanted to slightly reducing his speed there is an inherrent issue with making final boss have flat capped stats like that, stat variance. Having a final boss be too strong is a concern that has to be addressed at all times. Which Upon rereading your comments seems like you agree to some extent.

Gotoh’s are a whole other problem. Personally I feel like if you felt the need to give the player a Gotoh then you should just weaken the boss slightly since clearly it felt like the final boss might be too strong given the stats averages of the player army.

I feel like this one has some issues the most though, given you liked medeus it seems like you forgot about his attrociously designed predecessor, Gharnef, who literally can only be harmed by the Starlight Tome, a tome that has unlock conditions that can failed preventing you from getting the falchion which makes fighting medeus that much harder. Which is just overall bad design in the first place but that is a different conversations entirely.

Honestly the easy way to make a boss annoying would just be weary fighter, so they can’t be doubled at all, Renewal/Nosf-effect weapon for sustainablity, and decently high defence and res with a girthy health pool.

There are so many ways to make a final boss be either good or bad, really it should just be how well the boss works in the confines of the story their in. You wouldn’t expect/enjoy a game/hack the had a fair difficulty curve to just slap you with Lunatic Medeus as the final boss unjustifiablily would you?

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Those are my thoughts exactly. Although the boss I’m planning will have way higher stats and will be nigh impossible to be defeated by any class.

But before the final chapters players will have to defeat the five heroes in their respective temples and gain their power. It will effectively increase their Weapon’s power in every way and it will give sheer boost to stats. Even that won’t make the final boss less threatening but the player units will be able to survive. Final boss won’t be invincible because the legendary regalia weapons will be locked to the royals. With the exception of few legendary weapons which anyone can wield but they are breakable and have no effectiveness against monster or final boss. But these weapons will have higher might.

The royals will have high growths (not broken) which will guarantee that they will be able to combat the final boss. His stats will be around 70’s. But don’t worry Regalia weapons will make them the strongest humans on land. Just like how any legendary hero should be.

Others won’t be completely useless either. While the royals surround the final boss, his pawns may try to hinder them. It’s the work of every other soldier to prevent it. (Everyone from playable cast and some strong green units). The enemy (More in power) will be infinite but so will be green units (More in number) because every soldier from the land is taking part in this fight.

A Gotoh character will be there who will be able to wield any magic (even Prfs) just in case your magic royal unit gets RNG screwed.

Your point is fair and noted. But please understand that a final boss is meant to be a final challenge for players. It would be extremely disappointing if players like a certain battle or boss but the fight with them is too short because he is too easy.

Ganondorf from TP is perfect example. That fight was epic as hell but it didn’t last long enough for players to enjoy the music and battle. (I’ll try my best to make a boss with some character even if I fail a dozen times.)

That’s a good point. Players should never be in a position where they find themselves stuck. So that’s why everything that is required to beat the boss will be plotline. (You can’t skip the requirements even if you wanted to.)

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I understand a final boss should be challenging, however there are limits.

However, that is the exact thing I was warning against. Stat bloating that severe is something I advocate against because it’s cheap difficulty. I mean, if you want an example of how that idea can be bad Sun Gods Wrath has a final moss who is basically just a slightly stat bloated enemy, with a personal weapon with 100% crit guaranteeing any unit without a stat scroll or the special you get just for that map will die if they attack him.

The map itself can make the boss good or bad, and honestly just give the fight some actual mechanics and you’d probably get more mileage out of it.

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I’d say get creative.

One thing I did was make the bosses of my hack have power in multiple ways. One boss had a cleric healing him and a hoplon guard. You can steal the guard and recruit the cleric, and suddenly the boss can be chipped.

Make the boss difficult but make it feel rewarding for the player to find ways around certain advantages, and it feels like a fun little puzzle.

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“Last boss is a giant thing of stats” is annoying imo, even if the intent is to have the player lose some units. You can make people have units die by adding side objectives that either make reaching the boss easier/faster or weaken the boss/strengthen the player. If the side objectives are difficult to reach in a timely manner without playing hyper aggressively there you go.

“Multiple HP bars” is probably ideal for making a boss that has continued presence but does not have ridiculous stats; additional chances for the boss to attack means you can get resource gated on healing, weapon durability, or even just remaining viable units.

Combining that with map pressure should make a challenging final boss that doesn’t just feel like a slog where you try to figure out acting order to where they die in one turn.

Code of the Black Knights has a fin boss on one specific route that actually is pretty good, although the amount of things the map throws at you can be overwhelming and too fatiguing to play.