Take SotF, I think three range bows’ biggest issue is that it limits how far you can go. It is extremely difficult to set up a formation that stops a 3 range archer from attacking someone in their range by body blocking.
Counteracting body blocking is a good thing. It means you have to be a lot more careful and proactive with placement because you can’t just plop a couple guys in front of a weak unit and hope for the best. You can still progress, you just have to progress more carefully.
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Also that’s kind of the point of an archer, to fire behind enemy lines and loosen up what could otherwise be a stalemate.
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Since i im doing an indie and not a Hackrom i can take more liberties, but what im doing with the archers to make them viable is.
- 2-2 range at the start, but ranges like 2-3 and 2-4 as the standar in the most of the game.
- Bow damage formula use (Strenght/2) + (Skill/2) instead of just Strength so giving them a lot of skill is not only a hit/crit deal.
- The most ofensive stats in the game, so they can double a lot, and do a lot of damage.
Basically, since they are Ally Phase focused units, i give them a very good ally phase.
But Three Houses treatment is a good option i think, close counter so they can have a Enemy Phase, and Range bonusses so they can have a strategical use that others units dont have.
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THIS! idk why no one has thought of making the Short Bow 1-2 range. It’s literally called the Short Bow
Not sure what you mean by “no one”. There are plenty of hacks that do this, but less often now because people realized it was not good at making archers more viable.
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well… guess I need to play more hacks
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Short Bow does not refer to the range of the bow. It just refers to the size of the actual bow itself which makes it easier for horseback archers to equip. Furthermore, giving bows 1-2 range does not solve the main issue of why Bows are an inferior weapon type
The main reason why Archers are bad in most FE games is because their supposed niches, chipping enemy HP and killing enemies while avoiding a counter attack are irrelevant usually. This is usually because enemies are easily killed by player units without being chipped down prior and enemies don’t hit hard enough for avoiding a counterattack by them to have any impact on survivability.
Giving them 1-2 range in the context of FE7 and 8 for instance would just further add to the existing problem of 1-2 range weaponry like Hand Axes and Javelins being too flexible in too many situations thereby reducing the strategic depth in the game. There wouldn’t be anything unique about the weapon type aside from being a physical counterpart to Tomes but if it was only on Short Bows then Archers would still have the issue of being glued to a low Mt weapon.
All you really need to do is make enemies powerful in both survivability (although not too much to the point where gameplay flow is slowed down) and offence (although not too much to the point where healing and tanking are rarely possible) and also make sure other weapon types can’t chip with physical damage or deal with fliers as easily as bows can.
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wouldn’t the size of the bow itself irl make shooting distance shorter? And I know it’s not a final solution, and that it’s more of a stats issue, but I still belive a 1-2 range bow is a good idea, it’d be like an inverse javelin/hand axe for archers.
Crossbows exist in 9 and 10 (they’re basically 1-2 range bows with set MT), and while they’re okay, they really don’t fix anything.
The size of a bow IRL mostly changes how cumbersome it is to use, it’s armor piercing qualities, and yes, range (but pretty much only for long bows).
A real life British LongBow would be like if you took an FE Silver bow and gave it extended range. (longbows could pierce armor and strike at least a half mile away.)
Like someone else said, the strength of Shortbows is that they could easily be used by horsemen, and in fantasy settings fighters too. IRL Assyrian archers rode on horsback at high speed and shot people at point blank range with deadly accuracy.
Truth is, if we made FE archers like historical real life archers, it would change the entire game.
So 1-2 range short bows are historically accurate? cool.
Also, now I realize why Rath in FE7 comes with a short bow
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Fun Fact: Almost all of the playable Nomads/Nomadic Troopers (and Uhai) come with Short Bows in their inventories.
The exception is Sue who comes with no weapons, but you get the Short Bow in the same chapter in a chest.
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…Isn’t Uhai’s class Nomadic Trooper too? Or am I remembering something wrong?
He ain’t playable, sadly.
Oh, I know he isn’t playable. I just got a little confused; by your wording, it was implied that Uhai was NOT a nomad/nomadic trooper
Foot archers’ main use in history was to kill enemy cavalry before they were able to strike. Cavarly was unbeatable on close combat and dominant in war, so their armor piercing arrows could strike them down without suffering any loss. Of course this doesn’t happen in anime chess, so cavarly remains dominant.
Archers were made as a way to kill a strong unit without risking a close combat, and in Fire Emblem, you are the strong unit. The generic enemies are way weaker than your normal ones and you’ve got plenty of ways to kill a strong unit. Archers are useful when you have that need of striking without a counterattack, and this series’ focus is in quantity over qualitiy of enemies, so their design is against the game’s map design
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No tile scale is ever given and I don’t know the actual range of a well made ballista. Someone needs to do some math.
Speed stats on a bow user are quite realistic. If each combat round is say 5 seconds they devote all that time to either attacking or defending if there is a counter attack. Their inability to counter at close range is a reflection of this inability to multitask whereas side stepping is enough at long range.
As are skill based stat growths as it is kind of hard to head shot a moving target whereas with a sword a reflexive crude muscle movement based swing in that general direction could actually do the job. So those would be the main things they work so unless they are using huge recurve bows a strength build archer isn’t that realistic. The other two stats would receive the most usage thus gain.
Just greater availability of long bows could accomplish the task. It is just a longer piece of curved wood. Why are they so rare?
But speaking of stats being used you could boost their res growth as that is one of the more likely counter attackers and high speed and res would make them specialize as mage killers.
Plus possibly the +20 crit boost on Sniper promotion.
A clear tile to metres ratio really doesn’t work because FE battles take place indoors, in villages, outside castles, and over vast fields. (I’d guess indoors is roughly 1 tile = 3 Cubic metres)
Skilled archers can reload with one hand (their firing hand), they also grab a clump of arrows from their quiver and hold the excess in their hand for ready loading, this means unloading 4 shots in 5 seconds is very realistic.
If you’ve ever fired a pistol you’d know that the “they can’t fire at close range” argument really doesn’t hold up.
Headshotting a moving target while stationary IS very difficult, but typically a headshot would be a crit. striking someone in the body is easier (akin to hitting a target) and hitting a moving target isn’t so bad if you have practice firing while moving (because in regards to aim, movement is all relative)
The resistance on a full sized bow can be quite strong (we’re talking up to 100 pounds in force), and many bows are over 5 feet long. So I think a moderate strength growth would be in order (they got biceps yo.)
It is just a longer piece of curved wood.
Not really, this is kind of like calling a Samurai sword a “Stick of Metal.” There’s a lot of craftsmanship involved and the whole process can take years. There’s a reason they weren’t widespread until the English invented them. (And also why shortbows are much more popular)
Statwise I’d say Shinnon from FE10 is a pretty good representation of a skilled foot archer if you lower his defense growth a bit.
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Ok you grab something and aim with a sword right in your face. You might get off a shot but you will spend way more time dodging and increase the odds of breaking your bow to a swing if it is out front. You will realistically use all your time dodging. After you dodge the sword will still be in your face on a back swing. Sure you could try shooting that many times but no real person can aim them perfectly. The game rendering is a gross simplification.
Also yes really I have watched bows be made by bending them in fire.