Standing Animation Question

I recently corrected Fa’s palette problem in her transform animation from FE6 and combined it with her battle animation when transformed. I planned to use this in conjunction with the standing mode to have a transformation to her Manakete form when the battle began where she would stay that way for the duration of the battle.

However, I may have been mistaken. I got the idea from an old topic on here (can’t remember which one) so when I actually put it in game this happened https://youtu.be/bp2m3VfnRV8?t=24s

Just wondering if I maybe misunderstood something. The script is below for reference. (Sorry for its length)

//begin Mode 1
C03
C07
1 p- frame000.png
3 p- frame001.png
5 p- frame002.png
1 p- frame003.png
1 p- frame013.png
C05
1 p- frame004.png
C01
3 p- frame005.png
C06
2 p- frame006.png
C0D

//begin Mode 3
C03
C07
1  p- frame000.png
3  p- frame009.png
20  p- frame010.png
2  p- frame011.png
2  p- frame012.png
18  p- frame010.png
2  p- frame011.png
2  p- frame012.png
15  p- frame010.png
2  p- frame011.png
2  p- frame012.png
3  p- frame010.png
2  p- frame011.png
2  p- frame012.png
3  p- frame010.png
2  p- frame011.png
2  p- frame012.png
3  p- frame010.png
2  p- frame011.png
2  p- frame012.png
2  p- frame010.png
2  p- frame011.png
2  p- frame012.png
2  p- frame010.png
2  p- frame011.png
2  p- frame012.png
2  p- frame010.png
2  p- frame011.png
2  p- frame012.png
2  p- frame010.png
2  p- frame011.png
2  p- frame012.png
2  p- frame010.png
2  p- frame011.png
2  p- frame012.png
2  p- frame009.png
3  p- frame001.png
5  p- frame002.png
1  p- frame003.png
1  p- frame013.png
C05
1  p- frame004.png
C01
3  p- frame005.png
C06
2  p- frame006.png
C0D

//begin Mode 5
C03
C07
1 p- frame000.png
3 p- frame001.png
5 p- frame002.png
1 p- frame003.png
1 p- frame013.png
C05
1 p- frame004.png
C01
3 p- frame005.png
C06
2 p- frame006.png
C0D

//begin Mode 6
C03
C07
1  p- frame000.png
3  p- frame001.png
5  p- frame002.png
1  p- frame003.png
1  p- frame013.png
C05
1  p- frame004.png
C01
3  p- frame005.png
C06
2  p- frame006.png
C0D

//begin Mode 7
C02
1 p- frame000.png
C0E
3 p- frame007.png
1 p- frame008.png
C01
3 p- frame007.png
C0D

//begin Mode 8
C02
1  p- frame000.png
C0E
3  p- frame007.png
1  p- frame008.png
C01
3  p- frame007.png
C0D

//begin Mode 9
4 p- transform3.png
1 p- transform4.png
1 p- transform5.png
1 p- transform6.png
C25
12 p- transform7.png
2 p- transform13.png
2 p- transform14.png
3 p- transform15.png
2 p- transform16.png
3 p- transform17.png
2 p- transform18.png
2 p- transform19.png
2 p- transform20.png
1 p- frame000.png
C01

//begin Mode 10
4  p- transform3.png
1  p- transform4.png
1  p- transform5.png
1  p- transform6.png
C25
12  p- transform7.png
2  p- transform13.png
2  p- transform14.png
3  p- transform15.png
2  p- transform16.png
3  p- transform17.png
2  p- transform18.png
2  p- transform19.png
2  p- transform20.png
1  p- frame000.png
C01

//begin Mode 11
4 p- transform3.png
1 p- transform4.png
1 p- transform5.png
1 p- transform6.png
C25
12 p- transform7.png
2 p- transform13.png
2 p- transform14.png
3 p- transform15.png
2 p- transform16.png
3 p- transform17.png
2 p- transform18.png
2 p- transform19.png
2 p- transform20.png
1 p- frame000.png
C01

//begin Mode 12
C03
C07
1  p- frame000.png
3  p- frame001.png
5  p- frame002.png
1  p- frame003.png
1  p- frame013.png
C05
1  p- frame004.png
C01
3  p- frame005.png
C06
2  p- frame006.png
C0D

//End of animation script

1 Like

Well I’m glad to see somebody making use of those standing modes! If I had to guess, mode 9 doesn’t just get called at the start of the animation, but also in between other things like the dodge too. I was under the impression it only got called the once, but clearly that’s not the case.

The only animation I can think of that uses modes 9-11 is the unused Kishuna one in FE7, but I’d have to double-check. Your script looks fine otherwise but I’ll bet there’s a way to get it to work the way you’re intending.

Wow. That’s almost perfect, man. I tip my hat you! Closest thing to working Manaketes I’ve seen in FE7.

Mode 9: Standing animation
Mode 10: Standing animation again?
Mode 11: Ranged standing animation

That’s what the documentation says. I don’t know if Manaketes would be possible under this setup, but perhaps the modes could be repurposed to enable the functionality?

Something like…

Mode 9: Starting animation (only plays at start of battle sequence; if both classes have one, play the initiator first and the defender second)
Mode 10: Standing animation
Mode 11: Ending animation (only plays at end of battle sequence)

This would preserve the functionality as Kishuna uses it, while expanding it to cover Manaketes (because why do you need a different standing animation at range and two duplicate modes anyway?).

This might be a viable option. We’d have to look into the battle engine a bit and see how much it would take to modify how it calls each mode, so I don’t know how tough that would be.

I know the manakete transform uses some tricks to call 3 different animations in a particular order (manakete transform, transformed attack, and detransform) which I think is ASM unless I’m mistaken. I wonder if they ended up scrapping the mode 9-11 for that instead since only 2 classes would need it?

Woah, feedback! So it seems that I didn’t actually mess up, but no one actually tried to make use of the standing animation? That’s unfortunate. I understand the bare basics of ASM so I can’t do anything to fix it. But maybe one of you wizards can think something up. I just wish I could have used most of the transform animation. It would have made the transformation look far better so I was disappointed to learn the frame count that was allowable.

Mode 11 is required because Hand Axes and Javelins require a different standing animation at range.

Actually, most Handaxes use separate animations from far instead of the original one (just take a look at the animation table in FEditor or the Battle Animation Editor in Nightmare). And many of the characters who have javelins have the exact same standing stance from far (are there even any who don’t?)

If anyone were to rewrite the way these worked, they could just make the standing animation from afar read from the normal standing animation. Then there would be no conflicts.

Great, let’s get on that. Where do I start?

You would need to know how to do ASM. So I have no idea.

Well, I’ve done a bit of looking into modes 9 - 11 and I’m not sure if these alterations would be all that viable. Mode 9 & 10 seem to work like Mode 1 & 2 or 3 & 4 work (mode 1 is Foreground, while mode 2 is Background). I still need to do a bit of testing to see if this is the case, but it makes sense. Unfortunately, there are very few animations that even use these modes ingame, hence the lack of research.

There’s only two Animations I can recall that even use these modes (Fa’s Untransformed animation and the unused Kishuna animation in FE7) but I think the doc defines them a bit inaccurately.

Mode 9 - 11 act like idling animations, not standing animations. Meaning that by default it will loop either 9 & 10 at close range or mode 11 for far range. The game jumps to another mode as needed, but returns to the idle animation, which appears to be what happens for your animation @HeartlessSeph (although I’m not sure why it doesn’t loop like the default animaitons do).

@circleseverywhere It’s not required to have a different javelin compared to the melee lance, but there are animations that do use this (Ephraim’s unpromoted animation does, I’m sure there’s more) so I’d reccomend against repurposing it. (Besides I have a feeling there’s some animators out there who might be interested in making idle animations an actual thing now ;))

1 Like

Well, the other alternative is to use extra animations for pre and post battle, like Manaketes do. Do we have any documentation on how that works?

Rumor has it that someone actually did successfully implement FE6 style manaketes in Fe7, but the research was lost to the ether. Like all of the files and information were wiped out and the creator of said animation wasn’t active pretty soon after. I’m sure some of the Veteran hackers could actually remember this, but I’m just a newbie!

There’s been some talk of another hacker working on this very thing, but I couldn’t comment on any progress. It is being worked on as far as I know though!

I remember that being mentioned. I also wasn’t around when it happened but it sucks either way honestly.

Well, how about for FE8? Since Manaketes are already in the game it should be easier to expand transformations to other classes.

Well yes, it should be. But honestly, as someone who doesn’t hack FE8, implementing the feature to even have 1 manakete in FE7 is more appealing to me.

FE8 uses the same mechanic that FE6 does, it’s basically using ASM to call each seperate animation, we just need to figure out how it decides how to do this. Again, it’s not my forte, but it’s getting looked into.

The thing is, @HeartlessSeph makes the point that it’d be nice to have the system in FE7 at all, but I’d love to see multiple transforming animations in an engine at least.

Okay, this is really weird. By simply changing the number of frames to display, and removing the C01 at the end of Mode 9, I can do this: (link removed)

Which is almost perfect, except for that brief frame before the dodge.

//begin Mode 9
8  p- Unsheathe-1.png
6  p- Unsheathe-2.png
6  p- Unsheathe-3.png
16  p- Standing-1.png
//C01
~~~
//begin Mode 10
16  p- Standing-1.png
C01
~~~
//begin Mode 11
16  p- Standing-1.png
C01
1 Like

Hm, maybe by finding a certain amount of frames it can cause it to stop showing the opening animation at any other point but the opening. Or maybe not, I don’t understand the specifics of this regardless.

Did a bit more experimenting: I think the important thing is that there is no C01 at the end there. Duration of frames didn’t seem to do much.

I managed to fix the frame before the dodge by adding

0  p- Standing-1.png

at the start of Mode 9, but now the problem is at the start of the animation instead because it shows the first frame while zooming into the battle scene even though the duration is 0.

From what I can tell:

  • Pre-battle zoom in - first frame of Mode 9 (even if 0 duration)
  • Start of battle - Mode 9 animation, stop on last frame (graphical glitches occur if last frame has 0 duration) or loop if C01 is present
  • Between an attack and a dodge - first frame of Mode 9 (even if 0 duration)
  • All other idle frames - last frame of Mode 9

Mode 10 seems to do nothing, at least I’ve never been able to get any of its frames to show.

EDIT: New discovery - if you have any 0x85 commands in Mode 9 (like your C25), the animation will play at every opportunity.

3 Likes

I got it working! (link removed)

Solution:

  • No 0x85 commands in Modes 9/11 (this means no C01, and unfortunately means no sound effects.)
  • Add 10 idle frames to the start of Mode 7 and 8 before the C02/C18
  • Add 10 idle frames to the end of your attacks after C06 and before C0D

So my standing animation looks like:

//begin Mode 9
18  p- Unsheathe-1.png
5  p- Unsheathe-2.png
5  p- Unsheathe-3.png
1  p- Standing-1.png

My dodge looks like:

//begin Mode 7
10  p- Standing-1.png
C18
1  p- Standing-1.png
C0E
3  p- Dodge-1.png
1  p- Dodge-2.png
C01
3  p- Dodge-1.png
C0D

And my attack looks like:

//begin Mode 1
C03
C07
1  p- Standing-1.png
2  p- Attack-1.png
C1B
2  p- Attack-2.png
2  p- Attack-3.png
2  p- Attack-4.png
6  p- Attack-5.png
5  p- Attack-6.png
5  p- Attack-7.png
5  p- Attack-8.png
5  p- Attack-9.png
C04
C1A
C1F
10  p- Attack-10p.png
C01
5  p- Attack-11p.png
5  p- Attack-12p.png
5  p- Attack-13p.png
2  p- Attack-14p.png
C22
2  p- Attack-15.png
2  p- Attack-16.png
3  p- Attack-17.png
3  p- Attack-18.png
3  p- Attack-19.png
3  p- Attack-20.png
3  p- Attack-21.png
C06
10  p- Standing-1.png
C0D
8 Likes